Monday, August 03, 2009

Canada Health Care: Yet Another Horror Story

9 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Most freshmen philosophy students know an argument from anecdote when they see one. Do you?

6:58 PM  
Blogger John McAdams said...

Most freshmen philosophy students know an argument from anecdote when they see one. Do you?

But systematic data show that people in Canada and the U.K. have to wait a very long time to see a specialist.

By the way, do you object to "argument from anecdote" when it comes from supporters of socialized medicine?

9:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"But systematic data show that people in Canada and the U.K. have to wait a very long time to see a specialist."

How come you never cite systematic data on this blog unless it comes from a partisan source? And besides, I would think waiting to see a specialist would be preferable to not having health insurance at all. Not to mention that nobody is forcing the public option on you.

"By the way, do you object to "argument from anecdote" when it comes from supporters of socialized medicine?"

Absolutely.

11:58 AM  
Blogger John McAdams said...

Not to mention that nobody is forcing the public option on you.

No, the intent is precisely to force it on me and everybody else.

7:38 PM  
Blogger krshorewood said...

You mean the way the government forces police and fire protection on you?

12:15 AM  
Blogger Grant said...

About that "systematic data". Please tell me you're neither so stupid nor so gullible as to not realize that the data on supposed "wait times" in the US system only looks better because they DON'T COUNT people who are simply NEVER going to receive the procedures in question as technically "waiting" for them.

Factor in all the people who have, here in the real world, effective *indefinite* wait times in the US (or at least until they turn 65 and qualify for Medicare... you know, scary scary government provided insurance) and the picture would look a tiny bit different for that particular statistic.

In the meantime, the Canadians are spending 35% less for their system, having it cover far more people, producing equal or superior health outcomes in the majority of studies performed, give their citizens far greater security since their health coverage is totally portable and independent of their employers, perform significantly better on preventing medically preventable death, live longer, have lower infant mortality... and you want to base an argument on "look, there's this guy in Canada something unpleasant happened to... RUN AWAY!!!!"?

There are over 30 million freaking people in Canada. If you couldn't find a few bad stories anywhere in the nation they would have named the place *Utopia* instead.

Should we start lining up the US horror stories too? How many do you think exist in the ranks of the 47 million uninsured people? And the tens of millions more UNDER insured people? How about we just get them all, one by one, in front of a television camera to start telling their little tales and when they're done... in say, a century or so... we can use THAT to determine how good the US health care system is? How about that?

1:20 PM  
Blogger John McAdams said...

producing equal or superior health outcomes in the majority of studies performed

No, if you look at data relating to the quality of health care (and not lifestyle) the U.S. does better. Things like cancer survival rates.

Infant mortality, for example, is driven by the failure to get good prenatal care. But poor women are elegible for Medicaid. But that doesn't mean they are going to choose to get good care.

And careful systematic studies show that Canadians have to wait months on average to see a specialist.

The situation is so bad that a Canadian court ruled unconstitutional the ban on private care.

http://mu-warrior.blogspot.com/2005/06/blow-to-canadas-system-of-socialized.html

9:27 PM  
Blogger John McAdams said...

their health coverage is totally portable and independent of their employers

Portable is good, but it doesn't require a government takeover. In fact, current policy has made big strides in that direction of portability.

9:30 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"No, if you look at data relating to the quality of health care (and not lifestyle) the U.S. does better. Things like cancer survival rates."

Please, can we get a link to the data?

12:29 PM  

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